{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/iiif/k35m902q6g/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Arthur \"Pigmeat\" Garner oral history, 2002 August 16"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/008/original/peabody-institute.logo.large.horizontal.blue.cropped.png?1549570058","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eArthur \"Pigmeat\" Garner (1920-2011) was a saxophonist and member of the Royal Theatre Orchestra. He played in the band at Douglass High School under the direction of W. Llewellyn Wilson. After graduating in 1939, he began playing with Tracy McCleary's Kentuckians at the Ritz and the Strand. During World War II, Garner performed with the 325th Army Band at Aberdeen Proving Grounds. In 1946, after his discharge from the Army, he returned to the band at the Royal Theatre. He played with bands led by Rivers Chambers, Flink Johnson, Louis Hamlin, and Gene Walker. He also toured with Gene Ammons's group, playing the Apollo Theater and Howard Theater. This recording contains a conversation between Garner and Peabody Institute archivist Elizabeth Schaaf while they are viewing historic photographs of jazz musicians in Baltimore.\u003c/p\u003e (Abstract)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["2002-08-16 (created)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Agent"]},"value":{"en":["Garner, Arthur, 1920-2011 (Interviewee)","Schaaf, Elizabeth M. (Interviewer)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Language"]},"value":{"en":["English (Primary)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Format"]},"value":{"en":["audio/mp3"]}},{"label":{"en":["Publisher"]},"value":{"en":["Peabody Institute of the Johns Hopkins University"]}},{"label":{"en":["Rights Statement"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eThe collection is open for use. Contact peabodyarchives@lists.jhu.edu for more information.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Source Metadata URI"]},"value":{"en":["aspace_ef906cc0e0571f9fde7cc7973cd40cb3"]}}],"summary":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eArthur \"Pigmeat\" Garner (1920-2011) was a saxophonist and member of the Royal Theatre Orchestra. He played in the band at Douglass High School under the direction of W. Llewellyn Wilson. After graduating in 1939, he began playing with Tracy McCleary's Kentuckians at the Ritz and the Strand. During World War II, Garner performed with the 325th Army Band at Aberdeen Proving Grounds. In 1946, after his discharge from the Army, he returned to the band at the Royal Theatre. He played with bands led by Rivers Chambers, Flink Johnson, Louis Hamlin, and Gene Walker. He also toured with Gene Ammons's group, playing the Apollo Theater and Howard Theater. This recording contains a conversation between Garner and Peabody Institute archivist Elizabeth Schaaf while they are viewing historic photographs of jazz musicians in Baltimore.\u003c/p\u003e"]},"requiredStatement":{"label":{"en":["Attribution"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eThe collection is open for use. Contact peabodyarchives@lists.jhu.edu for more information.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},"provider":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Peabody Institute of the Johns Hopkins University"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Peabody Institute of the Johns Hopkins University"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/008/original/peabody-institute.logo.large.horizontal.blue.cropped.png?1549570058","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/117/416/small/garner_photoshop_jpeg.jpg?1650135493","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - pims0091_GarnerA_01.mp3"]},"duration":3004.02939,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/117/416/small/garner_photoshop_jpeg.jpg?1650135493","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-peabody.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/117/416/original/pims0091_GarnerA_01.mp3?1624270839","type":"Audio","format":"audio/mpeg","duration":3004.02939,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["GarnerA_OHMS_20220608 [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ARTHUR GARNER: We were playing a society thing. \n\n\n\nELIZABETH SCHAAF: Oh, my goodness, where was this? \n\n\n\nGARNER: This was in the Belvedere Hotel. It was a thing that Mel Spears got\ntogether. You know, it was just nice because he [Roy McCoy] and I, we did so\nmany things over the years. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Mr. McCoy. He's a wonderful trumpet player, isn't he? \n\n\n\nGARNER: He's about the exact same age. He's born April the 3rd; I'm April the\n15th. Like I just passed eighty-two. He would have been eighty-two if he was\nstill here. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: I sure do miss him. He was just a wonderful man. \n\n\n\nGARNER: But that's the way it goes. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Now, who is this? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Here's a picture of him. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh my goodness, look how young he is. \n\n\n\nGARNER: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=0.0,60.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do you see the picture where I'm giving him a fish? Now this, you'll\nnever guess where this was. This is the band that played for Blaze Starr. This\nis what we did. This was before it integrated. It must have been in the '60s.\nThe fellow on the organ was Earl Hines. His name was Earl Hines, and Junior\nGarner [phonetic] played drums, Pinhead [phonetic] played trumpet and I played saxophone. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Now, who was on trumpet? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Pinhead. I'm trying to think of his name. Anyway, it was Pinhead. Earl\nHines, the Baltimore Earl Hines. See how we're all sharp and everything. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Boy, you sure were. \n\n\n\nGARNER: So I looked at her [Blaze Starr] every night. [Laughter] ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=60.0,120.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ain't that something? \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: I was surprised to find out that there were a lot of people who went\ndown to the clubs on the Block. I'm sure they took a look at the girls, but a\nlot of people, I found out, went down to listen to the bands down there. There\nwere some really good bands. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yes. This is a picture of me and Whit. Me and my buddy, Whit. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Whit Williams. The picture of Gary Thomas on the boat, when was that taken? \n\n\n\nGARNER: I have no idea. It was something they were having at the Inner Harber.\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=120.0,180.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I went down. I always carried my camera. There was something going on down\nat the Inner Harbor. I don't remember what it was. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Well, I was just surprised at how young Gary Thomas looks in that picture. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Well, he probably just come out of school because he played with this\nband, Lewis Hamlin's. That's when I first met him. He was with Lewis Hamlin's.\nLewis Hamlin was a school teacher. And I don't know whether he [Gary] had been\none of his students or what, but anyway, he came and he played with the band.\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=180.0,240.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Terrific musician. But they tell me he practiced eight hours a day. Or four or\nfive hours at the least. \n\n\n\nNow see, that's my earliest things there. Now this was another thing. This the\npicture that you had in your paper. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: That's Mr. Bailey over here? Is that Donald Bailey? \n\n\n\nGARNER: No. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: No, no. He's not in this one. \n\n\n\nGARNER: No, he might not even-- oh yeah, he was born then, but he was just a\nkid. But this is the same picture that you had in the paper. And this is me\nhere. But this was from '42 to '46. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: The 325th Army Band in Aberdeen. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Aberdeen Proving Grounds. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: How long were you stationed in Aberdeen? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Four years. '42 to '46. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=240.0,300.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's a good place to spend the war. When you were out there at Aberdeen,\nwere you able to get down to Baltimore for an evening out? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yes, of course. In fact, I even had a car. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh that was great. \n\n\n\nPack up and get some gas. But four years, and that's when I had a chance to\nreally get my horn together, my clarinet. I played E-flat clarinet, in the big\nfield band. You know, we had a big field band. Oh it was a big marching band,\nand this was just part of it. And this was the jazz orchestra. The same picture\nyou had. I don't know where you got your-- Did you get it from Roy? \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: It was from Roy. Yeah. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Well, he knew that band was from--of course, he didn't name the band. He\ndidn't name it at all. Of course, that's why I was surprised because he didn't\nsay that it was the jazz orchestra from the 325th Army Band at Aberdeen. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=300.0,360.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And\nthat's me sitting there. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: When I interviewed Mr. [Tracy] McCleary, he was telling me that during\nthe war when they were losing so many people to the service that he filled in\nhis band with folks from up at Aberdeen, and he had some military people playing\nin there. \n\n\n\nGARNER: After the war he was still using them people. I joined the band when I\ngot discharged in '46. Then I went back to play with Tracy. I played with Tracy\nwhen I first come out of school, you know, that other picture. That's when I\nfirst got out of school. \n\n\n\nThen I had to go in the Army. But Roy didn't have to go the Army. I don't know\nwhy Roy didn't have to go. I was drafted. Then when I went in the Army and\nstayed for four years, and when I come out, discharged, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=360.0,420.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's when I went back\nwith Tracy, and he had the house band in the Royal Theatre. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Where did you go to school? Were you at Douglass? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yup. Llewellyn Wilson. [Laughter] Right there. I started in the band in\nDouglass. I graduated in '39, so it must have been three or four years before I\ngraduated that I went-- My mother bought me a saxophone, and I started playing saxophone. \n\n\n\nAnd he was a hell of a music teacher. I graduated in '39. I came out in '39. And\nI could play well enough to go and start playing right with Tracy then. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh, right out of high school? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Right out of high school. But then I took some private lessons. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Who did you take private lessons from? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Down at Conn's [phonetic]. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: My brother took lessons down there. \n\n\n\nGARNER: You know, Conn's on Howard Street. Because my mother had to get me a\nprofessional horn because the horn I had in school was mostly a school horn. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=420.0,480.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And\nthen she took me and bought a professional horn. And I took some private\nlessons, but then the war broke out. See? \n\n\n\nI graduated in '39 then somehow Roy and I got together, other young dudes we\nplayed around town. But then I rehearsed with Tracy's band. He had a little\noffice down there on Pennsylvania and Lanvale Street. It was Tracy's Kentuckians\nthen. We played at the Ritz. Before the war, this was before the war. We played\nat the Ritz and we played at the Strand. And then, when the war broke out, I had\nto go in the service. But then I come back, and went along and played with all\nthe big names. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=480.0,540.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I played nightclubs, I played in Rivers Chambers group. Cut\ndown the pine tree every night. Then I decided to go on the road. And when I\nwent on the road, first I went with Bill Doggett and played the Howard, the\nApollo, and Atlantic City clubs. Then I come back home, then I went out again\nwith the huckabuck man, Paul Williams. And this was a thing where we played\nthirty-five one-nighters. Thirty-five one-nighters. All through the south, from\nTexas to Florida, all through the south. And this was all before public\naccommodations. So when I come back home this time, I went in the postal\nservice. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=540.0,600.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Something that the average musician wouldn't even think about doing.\nBut then I got married and I went in the postal service. And I did thirty years\nin the post office. So that was just before, Mickey Fields was just coming on\nthe scene then, see. \n\n\n\nBut that was the greatest move I ever made, I think. If I didn't do nothing but\nplay music, I might not be living like this. But anyway, I went in the post\noffice. But it so happened, I first went in the railway mail service, and I rode\nthe train for about six years. Then I transferred to the office in Baltimore,\nand I got back with the post office band, I worked with the post office band.\nThen I went back to my Army thing. I got my clarinet and the post office band\nused to play parades and concerts. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=600.0,660.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that's what I did. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh, my goodness. There you are. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Played parades and concerts with the post office band. Then when I\nretired, I went with the Gene Walker, Baltimore's big band, and that was a real\njoy. You ever heard of Gene Walker? \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh, yeah. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Well, I went with Gene Walker. So everything, music, my life's\nbeen--Then we did a parade. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: What in the world was it like touring the south back then? \n\n\n\nGARNER: It was something. Yeah. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: I mean, where did you stay? Everything was hard. Buying a cup of coffee,\nfinding a place to spend the night--? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. You know, colored water fountains and colored entrances. But it\nwas a big bus. It was a rhythm and blues show. They had the clothes on there.\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=660.0,720.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Faye Adams, Big Joe Turner, the blues singer, the Spencer Twins, Al Jackson was\nthe emcee. Most places, by being a colored show, like in auditoriums, we'd play\ndownstairs, and the colored would come in downstairs as long as it's a colored show. \n\n\n\nAnd some places we played two separate shows. Then we played those big tobacco\nwarehouses with the rope down the middle of the place. You know, whites on one\nside, colored on the other side. But that's the way it was then. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Well, Mr. Harris talked about playing in one of those places on the\ntour, and he mentioned the rope down the middle of the building. I must have\nmissed that it was a tobacco warehouse. Because he said that he had a really bad-- \n\n\n\nGARNER: Tobacco warehouse. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=720.0,780.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, they would play. But then when I come back\nin '56, that's when I went downtown to the civil service building. I was\nlooking, and I had to take an exam. But the opening was on the railway mail\nservice, so I went in the railway mail service. And that was another thing that\nwas a little different, working a mail car. But I did it for six years, and when\nI transferred to the Baltimore office, I didn't have no idea they had a band\nthere when I got there. And I played clarinet. I had everything I needed. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Well, where did you go on the train? Where did you catch the train, at\nPenn Station? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Washington. You would start from Washington to New York. Worked the mail\nup the line, you know. We'd start in Washington, D.C. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=780.0,840.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It would be two or three\nhours before the train would leave. Then we worked the mail from Maryland and\ngoing up to Delaware, Pennsylvania, until we'd get to New York. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Okay. And then you'd come back the same day? \n\n\n\nGARNER: No, we'd lay over. We'd get expense money and stay a while in New York.\nBecause I lived on this end. And then I would take trips going south. It would\nbe the same. You'd go back to the other stuff. And I'd take trips going on the\nB\u0026O. The B\u0026O would run through Cumberland, and it would run into other things\nwhere you would have to go to somebody's house. You couldn't stay in the wild.\nBut that's the way it was. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: God, what an adventure. [Laughter] \n\n\n\nGARNER: But then I'd go to New York and eat in Bickford's, and when I come home\nto Baltimore, I couldn't eat in Bickford's downtown. That's the way it was. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=840.0,900.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Like living in two different countries in the same place. \n\n\n\nGARNER: That's my story, but I've been lucky because I'm still here. I'm\ndivorced, but still here. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Well, where did you grow up in Baltimore? \n\n\n\nGARNER: In northwest Baltimore with my mother and my father. They both passed on. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: And what street was your house on? \n\n\n\nGARNER: We started off on Mosher Street. You know, I was born on McCulloh\nStreet, and we moved around Mosher Street, right in front of the big Catholic\nchurch, Immaculate Conception. My mother and father were Catholic, so we had to\ngo up to St. Peter's on -- \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Peter Claver. \n\n\n\nGARNER: On Fremont Avenue, St. Peter Claver's. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Right off Pennsylvania Avenue. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Beautiful church. Beautiful church. \n\n\n\nGARNER: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=900.0,960.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"My sister and I, we were in elementary school there, at the Catholic\nchurch. But I think I've had a pretty nice life. I have no complaints because\nit's just not too many of us stay around this long. [Laughter] \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Well, I wanted to ask you, who else do you remember from the band at\nAberdeen besides Donald Bailey? Were there other folks from the Baltimore area\nin that band? \n\n\n\nGARNER: No. They were all mostly different places. You know, all different\nplaces, but there's still some of the big bands still left, but as far as this\ngroup they're all gone. Because there was three of us that played with Tracy--\nthe bass player, the trumpet player and me. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=960.0,1020.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We went with Tracy in the Royal. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Do you remember their names? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Oh yeah. This was Johnny Burks [phonetic]. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: The trumpet player. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yes. Willie Stewart [phonetic], the bass player. See, Dewitt Cook\n[phonetic] was the director of the band. He was director of the jazz band.\nDewitt Cook, sergeant. But we had it together because we had nice music.  \n\n\n\nThe Army was segregated too. One side, we had the colored service club. They had\ntwo big field bands, and I don't ever remember seeing the other band. They were\nthere, they had another. The 327th was the white band. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1020.0,1080.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"325th was the colored band. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Now there was a wonderful picture in here of a group of gentlemen in\nfront of the Ritz. Now where is this? \n\n\n\nGARNER: That was right at when I first came out of school. You see I'm young.\nAnd this was Bus Green. He was in the Club Orleans. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Who is this gentleman? \n\n\n\nGARNER: His name was Wilson. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh, the pianist. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: W. Llewellyn Wilson's son? \n\n\n\nGARNER: No. No. He wasn't any relation to him. Ernest Wilson. And this is Roy.\nWe were about twenty. We were both the same. We must have been about twenty\nyears old there. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1080.0,1140.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"All dressed up. Everybody looks very smart. Oh here it is. This is the one. \n\n\n\nGARNER: That was at the Ritz. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Okay. Now this was Tracy? \n\n\n\nGARNER: That's Tracy, yeah. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: And here you are over on the far right. And who are the other two? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Oh this was--I called him \"Weasel\" and Tracy would probably remember the\nnames though. Better than I do. This was the same fellow that played piano down\nin Blaze Starr's club. This was Earl Hines on piano with Tracy at that time. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: How did you get the nickname of \"Pigmeat\"? \n\n\n\nGARNER: He just picked it out because I looked so young. See, I just come out of\nschool, and see, these [were] all old fellows. See me? \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1140.0,1200.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, that's right. You are definitely the young man of that crew. So\nwas it Tracy who gave you that name? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yes. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Well, I just couldn't help but wonder about that. Now who do we have\nover here? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Oh, this is my car. And this is the reed section. This is Louisa's\nhusband. That's Aaron Gross. This was Earl Moltreaux [phonetic]. And I guess\nthat lady in there was Cecelia Cox. That's me, and this was--come to me in a\nminute. But that was the reed section. \n\n\n\nSee, the four of us and Tracy made up the reed section in the band. Tracy played saxophone. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1200.0,1260.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now where are we here? \n\n\n\nGARNER: This was at the Ritz. This was Ernest Wilson, me, and Roy. On the\npicture back there. And this was a thing where I used to go after the show, and\nthis was a hell of a good saxophone player from Washington, William Ross. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: And where was this? \n\n\n\nGARNER: This was in the Avenue Bar before they changed it. And that's Johnny\nReed on bass. He later went with the Orioles. And Bus Jackson [phonetic] on piano. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh, and there you are. \n\n\n\nGARNER: This is one of what's-his-name's pictures.  \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Gordon Anderson. \n\n\n\nGARNER: See, on that show was Nat King Cole, Savannah Churchill. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1260.0,1320.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The emcee was\nRalph Cooper, and he caught me outside signing autographs or something. \n\n\n\nSCHAFF: Oh and there you are. \n\n\n\nGARNER: That's Gordon, you know. Yeah, I'm doing my thing. And this is Tracy,\nand these are the Orioles. They were on the show. Everybody was on the show.\nYou'd sit down with the fast film because they didn't use no flash you'd be\nsitting in the audience. \n\nSCHAAF: Now, Mr. McCleary was talking about this group. He said, they played\nviolin well enough that they could have done it standing up and everybody would\nstill be impressed. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Oh he's got the same picture? \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Yes. He did. He did. Yeah. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Oh, okay. Okay. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: That was a great photograph. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Vi Burnside, her group was there You know, the all-girl band. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh, who was this now? Vi Burnside? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Vi Burnside. It's an all-girl band. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Were they local? \n\n\n\nGARNER: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1320.0,1380.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"No. No.  \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Because I don't-- \n\n\n\nGARNER: Here's the comedian. This is the comedian \"Pigmeat.\" \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh right. Right. Oh and this is Bus Green's band at the Club Orleans. \n\n\n\nGARNER: This is Earl Moltreaux [phonetic]. I don't know how I happened to be\nplaying with all these different groups, but sometimes it would be just after\nthe show at the Royal. I would go and be sitting in, and the fellow that did all\nthese pictures on the Avenue would just come in and I got another picture. \n\n\n\nNow this one group, this is the Avenue Bar, and I stayed there about three years. \n\n\n\nThat's [Leroy] Flink Johnson. He's a real character on the Avenue. He's a show,\na real show. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1380.0,1440.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Oh, and here's the Bill Doggett trio. \n\n\n\nGARNER: That's the Bill Doggett trio. That's where I played the Apollo and the\nHoward. I played in an Atlantic City club with Gene Ammons' group. He was with\none of the groups and I was with Doggett. So that was exciting. [Laughter] To be\non the same bill with Gene Ammons. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: These are great photographs. Oh, my goodness. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Now here's all of them. Now here's the Three Bees and the Honey. This is\nCharlie Ridgely, Louisa [Lara Gross], Wilbur Forrester [phonetic] was on guitar,\nand Burt Hall. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1440.0,1500.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now who are these? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Now, here's Johnny Sparrow. You heard of him? \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh, Johnny Sparrow and his Bows and Arrow. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah, Johnny Sparrow. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh my gosh. \n\n\n\nGARNER: And this was the picture--they had a picture on the wall in the Avenue\nBar with the group, you know. Frank and me and the other players. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh, my goodness. I wonder whatever happened to that? \n\n\n\nGARNER: I don't know. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh, that's wonderful. \n\nGARNER: And this is a tour that I was on with the 35 one nighters. The Clovers,\nand I got another picture with Faye Adams on there. And this is the Jolly Jax,\nanother local group. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1500.0,1560.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there's another sight from Rebop [phonetic]. During the\ntime that I was coming up, there was about four or five of us. Rebop, me, Bill\nSwindell, and Johnny Sparrow, and another fellow named Sam Till [phonetic], who\nplayed saxophone. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Now, what happened to Johnny Sparrow? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Passed on. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: I had heard about his group. \n\n\n\nGARNER: And these are some of the things that I took with that first big\nPolaroid. Count Basie, Lester [Young], Charlie Parker, that's Erroll Garner. I\ndon't know why I just never put the names down. This is Miles [Davis], Jimmy\nHeath, that's Sonny Rollins, that's Gene Ammons. I don't know why I didn't. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Well, if you want to put them, down you can use this pen. It'll write on\nthis shiny stuff. \n\n\n\nGARNER: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1560.0,1620.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'll do it later. But I don't know why I didn't. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: These are great photographs. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Well, it's all that Polaroid thing. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: That's all right. Look, it's held up well. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah, that's Illinois Jacquet. This is Arnie Carr [phonetic]. That's\nWillis Jackson, Sonny Stitt. There's the master, Coleman Hawkins. A young Stan\nGetz. Lou Donaldson. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: This is all at the Avenue Bar? \n\n\n\nGARNER: No. No. These were different places. Because when I was with Doggett, we\ndid a lot of work around Philly. It's a place called Peps [phonetic]. It would\nhave big names and Emerson's, and the Blue Note in north Philly. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1620.0,1680.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Great shots. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. That's Eddie Davis, James Moody. That's Bird [Charlie Parker] and\nLester again. That's Sallie Blair. I don't know these two ladies. I caught them somewhere. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Very decorative. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Now this is Johnny Hodges when he had his group. And that's Tiny\nBradshaw with Sil Austin on tenor. And this was Paul Quinichette. This is Bennie\nGreen the trombone player. And here's Erskine Hawkins. Remember Erskine Hawkins?\nAnd there's Bull Moose Jackson there. And this is Wild Bill Davison with Chris\nColumbus on drums. That's Art Farmer. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1680.0,1740.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"These are wonderful photographs. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Well, most of them are all gone. And [unclear] here. Max Roach, he still survives. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Yes. Yes. I saw him not long ago. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Red Rodney. And this is a young Billy Taylor. I think I took that\nsomewhere in Philly. And there's a young Ahmad Jamal. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh my goodness. \n\n\n\nGARNER: And this is Dave Brubeck. This was a pianist called Joe Loco. That's Lee\nKonitz. And that's [unclear] from Rebop, the saxophone player from here.\nCándido [Camero], from Congo. \n\n\n\nThis is on the show. They were on the show, Spencer Twins, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1740.0,1800.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and here's the\nClovers and Faye Adams. They were on that 35-day one-nighters. There's Dizzy\n[Gillespie] and that's Slam Stewart. I don't know these people here. \n\n\n\nNow here's Paul Williams and the people that were on that thirty-five\none-nighter thing. [unclear] That's quite a collection, I think. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh my goodness. I mean it's just wonderful. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Here's somebody, newer thing. That's my buddy here. That's another one\nof my buddies, Wilbur Phillips, local saxophone player, he passed on. Just about\neverybody's gone. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1800.0,1860.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Here's Arnold Sterling. He was playing with the Lewis Hamlin\nband, and we played over at the Haven. We played the Haven. I mean, it's big\nband there in the Haven. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: That's not a whole lot of room in there. \n\n\n\nGARNER: No, no. Here's Ruby Glover. And another fellow, Eddie Garr [phonetic].\nAnd this is the first group I went in the Avenue with. This was 1951. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Flink Johnson and His All-Stars. \n\n\n\nGARNER: And this was a fellow named Lou Bennett. He was local. He went to Paris.\nIn fact, he stayed in Europe until he passed on. Ida James. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1860.0,1920.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that was in '51. Wow. \n\n\n\nGARNER: So that was a party in Jones's. Whole lot of people. I don't even\nremember them. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh, here's Gene Walker's band. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yes. And here are some of my old buddies. See Spears used to live up in\nChurchville when he was married. We used to have parties. And this is some of\nthe old group. Here's Charlie Harris. There's King Draper [phonetic]. He had a\nband way back there. There's Wilbur Phillips, there's Gilbert Church [phonetic].\nHe just passed not too long ago. And there's Roy, and there's me, and there's\nSpears. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1920.0,1980.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now you've seen all my life. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: You worked at the post office then. \n\n\n\nGARNER: That's where I'm getting my gold card. I'm a life member in the union.\nJust got my fifty-year pin. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: So when you joined, the unions hadn't gotten together yet. \n\nGARNER: No. There were two separate unions. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Where was union headquarters when you joined? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Well, it was on Pennsylvania Avenue then. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: There's a wonderful photograph that Mr. McCoy took of some of the\nmusicians down in front of the union headquarters. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah, oh yeah. It could have been either Pennsylvania Avenue or Argyle\nAvenue, the next street over. Just those two places where we had. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: I was going to ask you, how old were you when you started playing? \n\n\n\nGARNER: When I started playing saxophone? A couple years before I graduated from\nhigh school. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: How did you get into playing sax? ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=1980.0,2040.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Was anybody else in your family musical? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Well, my sister played piano. She started taking piano lessons. She was\nreal good. Then she played this horn thing in the Park Band during the war. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: When she went in the Park Band, did they give her a hard time being the\nonly girl? \n\n\n\nGARNER: I never even talked to her about it. Although, I have pictures of her. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Because we talked to Miss [Rosalie] White about her going in, and she\nsaid she was already playing with some of the guys over at Douglass so she knew\nmost everybody in the band when she went in. And everybody was pretty nice. \n\n\n\nGARNER : Yeah. It's amazing, she's still in the union book so I guess she's\nstill paying her union dues. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Yeah. She still lives just up the street from me over on Madison. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Because we came out together. We came out in '39. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2040.0,2100.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We just had our\nsixtieth reunion in '99. That was sixty years finishing Douglass. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: That's great. So you've seen Baltimore--you saw all the changes. I mean\nmy goodness, when you started working on Pennsylvania Avenue, it must have been\njust the heyday of Pennsylvania Avenue. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. Good old days. \n\nSCHAAF: Somebody was telling me, I can't remember who it was, about a place\ncalled Mama's. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. Right across the Royal. She used to send food all over the country. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Really? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. Some of the big names would want something from her. Fix something\nfor them, and she would send it to them. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: For heaven's sakes. There was something else that connected if that. I\ndon't remember what it was. Someone mentioned it the other day. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2100.0,2160.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We've been\nediting all these oral history interviews, and they all start running together\nafter awhile. Oh, I know. It was Tracy who was talking about how different some\nof the blocks were. He said that there was a place on the Avenue they used to\ncall the bottom. He said it was really depressing down there, and he said a lot\nof kind of shady going on down there. \n\n\n\nGARNER: That would be below Dolphin Street there. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: And he said they tried to stay wide of that area. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. The northwestern police station was right there at Dolphin Street.\nBut from there on up it was pretty nice. A lot of the pictures I have, I made at\nthe Tijuana. That was a club that used to be way up Pennsylvania Avenue, and\nthey used to bring big names. I think some of those pictures I have in there\nwith Miles [Davis] and Charlie Parker. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2160.0,2220.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They all were up there. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Tracy used to tell this wonderful story about when he was at the Comedy\nClub, when he had the band at the Comedy Club, with Ike Dixon. And that must\nhave been quite a place to go. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. They brought in big names too. I got some pictures in there of\nsome of the big names that they were bringing in too. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: I think Sammy Davis Jr. was there. Just came in there to sing. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Could have been. Yeah. In fact, I saw Ike at Church Anderson's memorial service. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Really? Oh my goodness. The senior? Or the second [Ike Dixon Jr.]? \n\n\n\nGARNER: The second one. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2220.0,2280.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"His brother passed on. Brother Harold, he's gone, I\nremember the father when he opened up the club. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: What was the Mr. Dixon Sr. like? \n\n\n\nGARNER: I don't know really know. But he had a nice eye for business, sure.\nYeah, the good old days. You just can't beat them. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Mrs. McCoy was telling me about going to the midnight shows at the\nRoyal. And some time ago I was a listening to an interview that someone did at\nthe Maryland Historical Society with Mr. Willie Adams. The interview was\nsupposed to be to get information about Mrs. Jackson [phonetic], ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2280.0,2340.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and he\nmentioned he was involved with the midnight shows at the Royal Theatre. And then\nI was desperate to find out how he was involved. I mean, did he finance them\nor--? But the interviewer cut him off and started asking him about Mrs. Jackson\nagain. So I never found out. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. He's still around too. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Yeah. Apparently his health has been kind of up and down. Mrs. Gross is\nthe only one of the singers that I have been able to locate. But there must have\nbeen a lot more vocalists. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Oh, yeah. There was quite a few. But I don't know what happened to them.\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2340.0,2400.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I remember Dot Kelly [phonetic] was one. But Louisa, she used to do a lot of\nthings. She went out there with Lionel Hampton, and Mrs. Hampton wouldn't give\nher a chaperone and she had to come back home. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: What a thrill that must have been, though, to be a teenager and be able\nto go out.  \n\n\n\nGARNER: Speaking of Hampton, I bet you never seen this. I don't know how I kept\nit so long, from 1946. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh, my goodness, look at that. \n\n\n\nGARNER: 1946. Charlie Harris is in there. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2400.0,2460.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Look how young he looks. And he's still going strong. That's great. \n\n\n\nGARNER: He would be 96 or 95 or something. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: William Mackel, he was around here for a long time. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. He was from Baltimore. He played with Bubby Johnson. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: He was also a friend of Mr. McCoy's, wasn't he? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: And didn't he write songs too? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah, he made arrangements. Yeah. That book has got everybody. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh there's Mr. Harris! \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. That book has got all the big named stars of that year. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2460.0,2520.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it was\nprinted by him [Hampton]. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh my gosh. Charlie. Oh yeah. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Everybody who was anybody during that time is in that book. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: That is just wonderful. Fats Waller. My mother was a great fan of Fats\nWaller. Oh and Mr. Ellington. Count Basie. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Before your time, yeah? \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: This is just wonderful. \n\n\n\nGARNER: I think that's a real collector's item. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: I think so. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2520.0,2580.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I've never seen this. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. 1946. I guess he was printing them every year. Write up about\neverybody, what they were doing during that time. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: I wanted to ask you what was the feeling in the union when they were\ngetting ready to join the union? Was there resistance to that, or do you\nremember any controversy or did everybody just think it was a good idea to get\non with it? \n\n\n\nGARNER: I think everybody thought it was a good idea because naturally the union\nuptown didn't have the pull of the union downtown. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2580.0,2640.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Although they did all right,\nbut I don't think it was run as well as the one downtown. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Well, I was always interested. I was reading through the newspapers, the\nAfro, about the union dispute with the Colored Symphony Orchestra. And the White\nunion wouldn't get behind them to support them in their dispute with Fred Huber\nand the Bureau of Municipal Music. It turned around and bit them later on\nbecause they ended up having to fight that same battle with Huber themselves.\nAnd if they had joined together with the union on Pennsylvania Avenue and fought\nthe battle then, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2640.0,2700.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the Baltimore Symphony Orchestra probably wouldn't have\ncollapsed in 1941 the way it did. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Oh, oh, oh. Yeah. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: But they weren't very long-sighted about it. Oh, Hazel Scott. Beautiful woman. \n\n\n\nGARNER: I know I bought that in '46, but I don't know where or when. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: This is great. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah. It's amazing I still have it, I guess. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Fletcher Henderson. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2700.0,2760.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Wow. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Of course, I remember a lot of those people, though. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Oh and there's Bill Kenny and the Ink Spots I don't see the Orioles\nmentioned. Were they later? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Yeah later. I think during that time it was just the Mills Brothers. And\nthe Ink Spots, I think the Ink Spots were there. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2760.0,2820.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Did you ever get to see Blanche Calloway perform? \n\n\n\nGARNER: No. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: I mean that's an older generation. I have one of her CDs. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Oh, she might have been at the Royal. I don't remember. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Well, I know she was early on when one of the Eubie Blake shows came to\nBaltimore. But I can't remember the date of that. But it was probably well back\nthere. Cozy Cole. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2820.0,2880.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is wonderful. Thank you for letting me see that. How long\ndid you play with the post office band? How many years was that? \n\n\n\nGARNER: All of a sudden they just cut it out. You see we rehearsed on the clock,\nand they just couldn't keep on doing that I guess. They had surplus instruments.\nIf anybody didn't have an instrument, they could use it. And it was nice. Of\ncourse, Mr. [Charles] Gwynn was one of the union people, and he was in the post\noffice. But he was the director. It was nice. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2880.0,2940.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How long has Gene Walker had his group? \n\n\n\nGARNER: Oh. It's got to be, he must be pushing thirty years. I think he's\npushing about thirty, or twenty-five, something like that. City pays the band.\nBut he always keeps some terrific musicians. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Yeah. I really enjoyed hearing them play. \n\n\n\nGARNER: I played a little bit for you the last time one video I had. \n\n\n\nSCHAAF: Yes. That's right. I enjoyed that. It was really good. \n\n\n\nGARNER: Roy was doing something. There wasn't too many brothers in the band,\nthere wasn't too many brothers could play his music. [Laughter] I guess, you\nknow. I really had fun with that band. Used to like to listen to the big sound.\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=2940.0,3000.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416/transcript/38423/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He had some-- \n\n\n\n[END OF SESSION] ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44132/file/117416#t=3000.0,3060.0"}]}]}]}