{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/iiif/nz80k27514/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Spencer J. Hammond oral history, 2002 August 30"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/008/original/peabody-institute.logo.large.horizontal.blue.cropped.png?1549570058","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":[" Spencer Hammond (1931-2019) was a minister of music, organist, and choir director at Douglas Memorial Community Church. Hammond taught music in Baltimore City Public Schools for 31 years until retiring in the early 1990s, taught a course on African-American music at the University of Maryland, Baltimore County, and taught piano. (Abstract)"," Poor audio quality and low levels present on source media. (Physical Description)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":[" 2002-08-30 (created)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Agent"]},"value":{"en":[" Hammond, Spencer J., 1931-2019 (Interviewee)"," Davis, Daniel Thomas (Interviewer)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Language"]},"value":{"en":[" English (Primary)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Format"]},"value":{"en":["audio/mp3"]}},{"label":{"en":["Publisher"]},"value":{"en":["Peabody Institute of the Johns Hopkins University"]}},{"label":{"en":["Rights Statement"]},"value":{"en":["The collection is open for use. Contact peabodyarchives@lists.jhu.edu for more information."]}},{"label":{"en":["Source Metadata URI"]},"value":{"en":["https://aspace.library.jhu.edu/repositories/4/archival_objects/215358"]}}],"summary":{"en":[" Spencer Hammond (1931-2019) was a minister of music, organist, and choir director at Douglas Memorial Community Church. Hammond taught music in Baltimore City Public Schools for 31 years until retiring in the early 1990s, taught a course on African-American music at the University of Maryland, Baltimore County, and taught piano."," Poor audio quality and low levels present on source media."]},"requiredStatement":{"label":{"en":["Attribution"]},"value":{"en":["The collection is open for use. Contact peabodyarchives@lists.jhu.edu for more information."]}},"provider":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Peabody Institute of the Johns Hopkins University"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Peabody Institute of the Johns Hopkins University"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/008/original/peabody-institute.logo.large.horizontal.blue.cropped.png?1549570058","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/public/images/audio-default.png","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 2 - pims0091_HammondS_01.mp3"]},"duration":3003.03674,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/public/images/audio-default.png","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-peabody.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/117/421/original/pims0091_HammondS_01.mp3?1624270849","type":"Audio","format":"audio/mpeg","duration":3003.03674,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["HammondS_1_OHMS_20220608 [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DANIEL THOMAS DAVIS: Today is Friday, August 30, 2002, and I am here with Mr.\nSpencer Hammond at the Douglas Memorial Community Church, corner of Lafayette\nand Madison, Baltimore. Thank you, Mr. Hammond. Well, I guess we'll start with I\nguess talking about where you came from and your early musical background. And\nyou said you came from Florida. \n\n\n\nSPENCER HAMMOND: Yeah. I'm from St. Augustine. I went to high school in St.\nAugustine, Florida, graduated from high school, and then I went to college. I\nwent to Florida A\u0026M. It's still a college there in Tallahassee, Florida. And I\ngraduated from there in 1951, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=0.0,60.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then I went to Northwestern University in the\nsummers starting in '53, and I graduated from there, from graduate, in 1958. And\nthat's as far as formal training I've had. I went to Peabody when I came here in\n1959 for a summer, and then the rest has been in service in workshops and things\nof that nature. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Right. So how did you become interested in music as a child? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Everybody in my house. Oh, no, let's not say that. All of the\ngrandchildren took piano lessons. This was during the time, all we had was radio. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Right. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: I don't come from a very large family. But I had a cousin older, and\nthen two cousins and then three other cousins. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=60.0,120.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We all took music. My oldest\ncousin played the piano quite well, and she had a piano in her house. I didn't\nhave a piano in my house at first. I went to my grandmother's house. My\ngrandmother had a piano. Eventually I got a piano. When they thought I was\nprobably serious about this because I would go down there. I'd stay with my\ngrandmother during the day while both my parents worked, and I was always\nbanging on the piano. They decided to give me lessons. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Right. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: And I went through a series of teachers. And when I was in high school,\nwell really in junior high school I think, it sort of caught fire. I always\nliked to play, and then of course I was a kid who grew up in church, so I was\nalways looking forward--there was always sort of a bit of interest in what was\ngoing on there with playing, having the privilege of playing for Sunday school.\nThen there was also the desire to want to play for church. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=120.0,180.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We had a small pipe\norgan there, and the lady played rather well. And I always wanted to play that. \n\n\n\nWhen I got in junior high school, her teacher, who was Lorenzo Pratt Oviatt, a\nYale grad who was at Flag Memorial Church, took me as a student for a few years.\nAnd I started taking organ lessons from him for about three years. And then he\ncould no longer teach me, and I did not take formal lessons again as far as\norgan until I went to college, but I continued with piano lessons. \n\n\n\nIt was after I studied with him, I went to Elizabeth Mitchell, who was not an\norgan teacher. She taught piano. She was a very fine piano teacher, who spent\nher winters in Florida. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=180.0,240.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"She also spent some time in Cuba at that time, and she\nlived with a lady here who had a big, big Victorian house there. And I found out\nabout it, and she took me on. \n\n\n\nI guess my tenth grade and eleventh grade it seems that she was not there my\nsenior year because she had gone to Cuba again. But then she got me ready for\ncollege, and I got a scholarship to Florida A\u0026M. I majored in music. I took\npiano lessons and organ lessons in college. And I enjoyed the choir, I sang in\nthe choir. Following the music curriculum. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Right. So, did you have sort of a style you were most interested in when\nyou were a child? What kind of church music were you brought up with? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=240.0,300.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, I came from a very staid conservative Baptist church where we\nsang the great hymns of the church. The choir on occasion sang spirituals, and\nthen there was one other element that I haven't mentioned and that was the\npresence of a college there. It was known then at first as part of normal\n[teacher] college. It was a Baptist school then, a two-year college, and then it\nbecame a four-year college, Florida Memorial College, and on Sundays, at least\none Sunday a month, they had a vestment service. And I heard, that's where I\nfirst heard, you know, things like the Hallelujah chorus, and \"I Waited for the\nLord,\" Mendelssohn, Bach and Handel. And very fine arrangements of spirituals by\nFred Hall and Sydney Johnson, who--Sydney Johnson taught me for a while. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=300.0,360.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he\narranged a lot of music. He had gone to Clark College and he studied with Fred\nHall, and his wife to this day, his ex-wife, says that she's not sure who wrote\nsome of those arrangements. Did Hall write them or did Sydney write them? She\nhad some of those things. \n\n\n\nBut I got an interest in music. And then, of course, you have with what you\nheard in church were standard hymns. So I grew up a little ahead of some of the\nstuff that's going on now. And as goes with the college choir. There was a\nstrong influence on this music in the churches because everybody wanted is choir\nto sound like the college choir. And the college choir at that time, it should\nnow, was the leader of the community. So if the choir sang [the] Hallelujah\nchorus in the Black community, then everybody wanted to sing it. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Right. They sang it that good. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah. Yeah. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=360.0,420.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They sang it very well. They were a fine school, a very\nfine choir. And so, then, there was a Bryant Walker who came there in my junior\nand senior year in high school, and that's when I first heard the music of\nWilliam Dawson. He was a Howard grad. I heard some very contemporary music, very\nfine music by contemporary composers I was trying to think of. There was a piece\nby--I can't think of their names now, but those names are still well known. And\nhe introduced those things. Of course we sang some of \"The Gospel of the World,\"\nand people would always like to sing \"Inflammatus\" in concerts and Gounod's\n\"Sanctus.\" And we heard those standard gems by college choirs and then church\nchoirs would try them out. We even sang some chestnuts. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=420.0,480.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Stuff like, I know\neverybody wanted to sing \"Let Mountain Zion Rejoice,\" and then \"Lift Up Your\nHead.\" These are two big anthems. One by Ashford, and I can't think of the name\nof the other man who wrote \"Let Mountain Zion Rejoice.\" And there would be\ncertain occasions where you would hear these things. \n\n\n\nAnd then there was a radio. And, of course, with the radio you heard people. You\nheard college choirs, and you heard The Telephone Hour, and The Firestone Hour\non Monday night, and then you heard the Salt Lake City Tabernacle Choir. So I\nheard music by Haydn and Handel and Mozart, and I liked that stuff I would\nlisten to it. And, of course, this is before television, so the art of listening\nwas a wonderful thing at that time. And so you would listen, on Sunday\nafternoons I would listen to the New York Philharmonic while I read the funny\npapers, and being Baptist, I was going back to church. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=480.0,540.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And after dinner, I\ncouldn't go out and play. Nobody could if you were going back to church. After\nyou ate dinner, you just sort of relaxed and read the papers, read the funnies,\nand listened to the radio. And everybody would be listening. And so it was hard\nto not hear some of the fine symphonies of Beethoven, hear Elijah, hear the\ndifferent performances on Sunday afternoon. \n\n \n\nRadio gave us that wonderful experience that I don't think radio gives us now.\nMaybe public radio at the best and in certain areas. And I find that these\nthings are being phased out now, but in those days that was not public radio,\nthat was CBS and NBC. You'd hear Toscanini on Saturdays. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: On NBC? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah, yeah, yeah, on NBC. You heard wonderful music. It was hard to\nignore it. You couldn't ignore it. It was there, and maybe the best way to\nignore it was turn it off, but I didn't. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=540.0,600.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I turned it on. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: That's funny. [Laughter] Were there many other young people your age in\nthe African community also listening to this kind of music or did you find yourself? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Listening to music when I was in high school? \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Uh-huh. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Some were. I remember my cousin and she lived next door, and it was\nalways interesting because Mr. Johnson also taught her. And we'd come over to\nher. She was working on, I remember, a piece by [Nathaniel] Dett, Juba. But I\nwould hear all the pieces she was practicing. Then I'd try to--when I got a\npiano--my first piano was fifty dollars. We bought a piano. We bought a\nsecondhand piano from somebody, and Mr. Johnson said, \"No, there's another piano\nthat's much better than that. Have them take it back and get the other one for\nfifty dollars.\" Big deal. Which stayed in my house until 1980 when my mother died. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: One of these big--? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah, big upright. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Big upright. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Big upright. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=600.0,660.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The size would take up a whole room it seems like. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah. Take up the whole wall. Even after I left St. Augustine, that\npiano. My mother loved that piano. And so people who were taking piano lessons\nwere always free to come to my house and practice even though I was long gone. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Right. Your mother sort of kept it a memorial-- \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Oh, yeah. She kept it. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: As an honorary until-- \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Oh, yes, until she died. That was a wonderful place. You could come in\nand play, and kids could come and practice their piano lessons. And then when I\nwas growing up, I had a godmother who taught at the school for the deaf and the\nblind, and she was a musician, and we would come, we'd play duets. And it was\nquite a social gathering around the piano. Something that I think might be\ncoming back into vogue now. I don't know. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: In my house it is. I don't know. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Oh, yeah. Right. Oh, yes, people come around, play the piano. So we\nwould have ice cream parties, and the family group, and then, let' s play some\nmusic. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=660.0,720.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And people would gather around and sing, or then she would bring these\nduets. I was a pretty good sight-reader. I didn't know that. I thought everybody\ndid that. And she would pick them out. She was very good at picking them at my\nlevel that I could play. And you'd just play away and enjoy ourselves. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: So you were steeped though in sort of the western classical tradition as\na child. \n\n \n\nHAMMOND: Oh, yeah. Right. I was aware of all of this. My father, who sang a\nlittle, he liked music, listened very carefully to The Telephone Hour and The\nFirestone Hour on Monday nights. And we just sort of listened. Different artists\nwould come on, \n\n[Lauritz] Melchior, Marian Anderson, Blanche Thebom, and even Lily Pons came on.\nThat's where I heard her. \n\n\n\nMy mother worked as a domestic with a family who loved opera, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=720.0,780.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and she would come\nhome on Saturdays. Now the deal was, get the house cleaned, you could go to the\nmovies. So I'm an only child. So you get it all done because when she got home\nfrom work, then you'd get that fifteen cents and you could go to the movies. Now\nif your work was not done, no movies. It was cut and dry. There was no in\nbetween. And so she would come home and she would say--because she would be\nthere. She had a sort of a light domestic job. She was a wonderful cook. She did\nlight housekeeping. And then when they finished on Saturday at dinner, they\nwould just go to the opera. So they would say to her, \"Catherine, Aida's on\ntoday.\" And then they knew her kid took piano lessons, and I'd be interested in\nmusic. So she'd come home and say Aida's on today. She'd turn the radio on and\nlisten. So my joke on Aida was, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=780.0,840.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I happened to bring that one up because I heard\nother operas just like that on Sundays. That same Metropolitan Opera concert\nprogram has been going on for the last--I think it's still going on. It was\ngoing on with--not Richard Cross. I can't think of his name. He was a wonderful\na commentator. Anyhow, the joke with me about Aida was that I was trying to\nfigure out how in the world you spell that thing. \n\n \n\nAnd you have these movies at school, fundraisers, and before the feature would\ncome on, you would have these selected short subjects. I was late going into the\nauditorium to see this movie that day, and someone was sitting there, and I\nsaid, \"What is that they're playing?\" The orchestra was playing. And it flashed\nacross there, they're playing the grand march from \"Ay-dah\" [phonetic], A-I-D-A.\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=840.0,900.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But that's what the person said to me. They're playing the grand march from\n\"Ay-dah.\" And I didn't say anything, but oh, that's how you spell Aida. [Laughter] \n\n\n\nBut even though I knew a lot of spirituals, I knew a lot of African American\nmusic because we sang it, along with the music, the hymns that we sang, I heard\na lot of old songs during the service. A lot of old songs that was lining out of\nhymns during the service. Sometimes, especially at what we would call testimony,\nand the people would just sing from their seats sometime before they had\nsomething to say, talking about the goodness of God. And that's where I would\nhear things like \"Let Us Cheer the Weary Traveler.\" And people just sort of knew\nit. They took it for granted. It wasn't a big deal. They just sang it. They\nknew, there was a song, \"You're Almost Home.\" ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=900.0,960.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There was a lady by the name of\nMrs. McClinton [phonetic], who was referred to as Mother McClinton, who was\nalways singing it. That would be her song before she stood up and gave her testimony. \n\n\n\nAnd so I heard a lot of spirituals that way. And we knew them. We just knew\nthem. I knew, and I didn't know a lot of them just the tip of iceberg. But I\nknew a lot of them. And the lining out of hymns. Along with traditional hymns of\nthe church, which I did grow up with. And, of course, that happened in my church\nand that happened at the AME Church around the corner. And that happened in the\nEpiscopal Church. I don't think they ever sang any spirituals there at that point. \n\n\n\nAnd now there were other churches there that sang. It was probably at the\nbeginning of some of the gospel song. But even then, there were other churches\nthere that sort of stylized some of the hymns. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=960.0,1020.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"For instance, I remember one\nchurch, I've told the choir this, that, you know the old song \"At the Cross,\"\nand there was a lady, I can't think of her name, but she would sing, she would\nteach her choir to sing \"At the Cross,\" and they sang [plays notes on the\npiano]. And so she jazzed it up a bit. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Yeah, right. Of course, you can be very square. [hums] \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah, yeah. We sang it straight. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Right. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: But that fascinated me. It was sort of interesting. But then they\nweren't going to sing it that way at First Baptist Church. They sang it\nstraight. And so that's where I guess where my church business came in. I stayed\nthere. I eventually played for the church on occasions. I was laughing. Those\nwere the days, this is after the Depression, the organist for the church, the\norganist, choir director, made six dollars a month. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1020.0,1080.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"A month. \n\n \n\nHAMMOND: A month. If you were the assistant, you got two dollars a month. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: So you needed another job if you were doing that. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. They were all doing something else. In fact, the\norganist, also, she taught first grade in the school. And even one of the\norganists taught fourth grade in another school. So they were not career\nmusicians. They did that as a side line. You can imagine, if they were just\ngetting six dollars a month playing for the church, what they were getting as\nteachers. They weren't getting very much. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Not very much. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: No, not very much. It wasn't a steady salary. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: So how did you get from St. Augustine to Baltimore? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: [Laughter] Well, there was a side trip. When I graduated from college,\nI was offered a job down in Manatee County, which is Bradenton area. You been\ndown there? \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Yeah. That's not too far from St. Petersburg. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Oh, no, not far at all, around the bay. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1080.0,1140.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the wife of one of my\nformer teachers taught music down there, and they needed an elementary teacher\nin the Black schools, in the elementary schools. There were three elementary\nschools in Manatee County at that time, Bradenton and Lincoln Memorial\nElementary, and then there was a little school called Rubonia Elementary, and I\nworked there five days a week. On two days larger schools, on Wednesday morning\nI went to Rubonia, which was a rural school, the only Black rural school left,\nand then the afternoon I came in and played for the high school choir. They\nrehearsed on Wednesday afternoons. \n\n\n\nAnd I stayed there from 1951 to 1959. In 1959, when Reverend [Marion] Bascom,\nwho was the minister--I have to back up a little bit. He had been my minister in\nSt. Augustine in the '40s. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Reverend Bascom from Douglas Memorial. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah. Right. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1140.0,1200.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so probably from about 1945 to 1947 when I left there,\nand then he said to me, as people say to people, \"oh, you know I think you have\na lot of talent. You grow up and I really need somebody to play, to be a\nmusician in my church. I'm going to come and get you.\" Well, I've told that\nstuff. You've heard that stuff from people. It's very nice, and you get so you\nsay thank you very much. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: And you never hear a word. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah, you never hear another word from them. And he had come to Howard\nto go to school. And while he was in Howard in 1949, he came over to Baltimore\nto preach, and Reverend Douglas had passed away. You never met Reverend Douglas.\nYou never met him. Reverend Douglas is gone. They needed a minister, and he, of\ncourse, applied for this job through the regular system that they do, and got it. \n\n\n\nSo he came in 1949, and he became the minister here. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1200.0,1260.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And in 1949 he became the\nminister here. In 1959 he we down at a church to preach, on a preaching mission,\nat a Baptist church in St. Petersburg. I knew he was coming because I had\nvisited that church. And of course he knew where I was. My mother was still\nalive, and she was always telling him. He would write her. People were writing\nletters in those days. So he said, how would you like to come to Baltimore? And\nI was married. We had had our first child, and I had to think about it. I had a\njob. I was quite secure. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Teaching and playing. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah, teaching. And I had a little church job. Well, with my wife's\npermission I came up here that summer to look it over. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1260.0,1320.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And this church had at\nthat time what they called a chancel choir, and a sanctuary choir, a youth\nchoir, a gospel choir. They had four choirs. And they had four different choir\ndirectors. He said I want somebody to coordinate this whole program, and I said,\nwell, I'll come up here and look at it. \n\n \n\nBut I did not resign my job when I came here. And I enjoyed it. This is where I\nwanted to be. This is where I can find the New York Times on Sunday and not on\nTuesday. In Bradenton, you get the New York Times on Tuesday, the Sunday New\nYork Times. And you can forget about the daily Times. And I could read about all\nthis stuff in the New York Herald Tribune. This was wonderful. Like I died and\ngone to heaven. \n\n\n\nOf course, I was taking a drop in pay. I was working here full time. My wife and\ndaughter, they moved up here. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1320.0,1380.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We lived upstairs in a house near Lafayette\nAvenue. Then I got a part time job at Morgan teaching piano, and assisting with\nthe choir, not really much. My job over there was to teach piano. I taught about\ntwo days a week. Oh, and I also had a couple of organ students. \n\n\n\nThen the job became a little shaky. And after all I had a degree, a master's\ndegree in music. And I decided to stop by on 25th Street and see if there were\nany openings part-time for teachers. Well, I filled out the application. I told\nthem I had a master's degree in music. And that I really enjoyed teaching, my\npreference was elementary school. I had taught elementary school in Florida. My\nsecond option was to teach high school. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1380.0,1440.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"My third option was middle school, well\njunior high school, at that time. \n\n\n\nAnd I got a telephone call from the director, and he said, \"I would offer you a\nfull-time job.\" He said, \"With your experience and your training, we have a job\nfor you.\" And I came back and talked to the church about it. I said, I've been\noffered a full-time job. I applied for a part-time job. And they gave me their\nblessing. And as one clergyman said to me, \"Oh, are you working at church full\ntime?\" I said, \"No, I'm working at church part time.\" He said, \"No, you're\nworking church full time for part-time pay.\" [Laughter] \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Oh, right. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: So I came here, and my job varied. I had to attend all rehearsals. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1440.0,1500.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I\nwas completely in charge of the chancel choir and the sanctuary choir. The\nperson who was in charge of the chancel choir then became my accompanist for the\nchancel choir. The person in charge of the sanctuary choir became my\naccompanist. And the person in charge of the gospel choir wanted to leave that\njob, but she held on for a while. And she stayed on for a while, but we got\nalong very well. And then the person in charge of the youth choir commuted, and\nso she was about to leave town. And so that became my job. \n\n\n\nAnd over the years it's been, that's what has happened. We still have a\nchildren's choir, sort of a children and youth choir. The chancel choir and the\nsanctuary choir merged into one group. The gospel choir, at that time, stopped,\nceased in about 1962 or '63, and then until about five years ago, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1500.0,1560.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then we now\nhave a gospel choir again, now called the inspirational choir. The chancel choir\nis still alive. And so now our chancel choir also breaks into units. The men of\nthe choir operate as a separate unit sometimes. So the men's choir. And on\noccasions, in the past, the ladies have sung as a unit. So that' s what we have\nat this time. We also have a handbell choir. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: So you're not teaching at all in the schools? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Oh, yes, for thirty years. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Where did you teach? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: 1962 until 1992. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Where did you teach? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND:  I taught elementary school. I taught elementary music all over town,\nreally, at [School] 141 and 150, I was there for seven years. I taught at the\ngifted and talented center in School 36 for about four or five years. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1560.0,1620.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And most\nof them are long-term jobs, and then, of course, the job descriptions changed in\nthe city. So sometimes you worked at one school. When I was at 150, I was there\nfull-time, and then as the music waned, the demand for music teachers waned, and\nthe funding for music waned, and everything went down. And it's going back up\nslowly now. It's slowly rising again, but it almost hit rock bottom. And there\nare some principals who wanted to have music in their schools, and you just\ndon't hear about them because that means that you'd be rushing to be your kid in\nthat school. So there are some schools who haven't suffered very much, and there\nare some schools that have suffered, they've suffered terribly.  \n\n\n\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1620.0,1680.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the problem has happened is that with no music in the elementary school in\nthe city, then we do not have boys and girls who are interested in being\nmusicians. If you don't have anybody who's interested in being a musician as a\ncareer, because that's where you pick them up, they don't start doing anything\nuntil the middle school, or maybe, in some middle schools, and the rest come in\nat ground zero at the high school level, where we have to start from nothing to\ndevelop in three years a musician. And that's a challenge for a lot of schools here. \n\n\n\nIt varies. It varies. But when I first came here, we would find a lot of kids\ntaking piano lessons. They even had piano teachers who were hired by the city to\nteach in the public schools. And I remember at the school where I taught, 150,\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1680.0,1740.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which had been elementary, I had as many as fifty-five kids signed up who took\npiano lessons from the lady who came in there. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Wow. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: So, there were a lot of kids, and it was cheap. And their parents--they\nwere interested, they took it and so the piano program died out in the city. And\nwe've had several programs that have come and gone. We had an organ program,\nteaching the organ by chord. I guess you heard about that. [Plays chords on a\npiano.] There's a sort of a system of theory where you put your thumb on C and\nyou could build a third up or fourth down. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Right.  \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: [Continues playing chords.] Then you'd teach them notation, and they\ncould play all kinds of stuff. So that went on for a while, but all of these\nwere things that could get children working with music. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1740.0,1800.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I'm very pleased\nwhen I find some kids who have taken what little experiences they've had, and\nwhose parents have really pushed them forward because that's what happened to\nme. They didn't have any music when I was in elementary school either. \n\n\n\nWhat I know what was going on, is that they were satisfying the state's\nrequirements by having assembly sings. And we would all go in there and sing\nsongs. They would spend the afternoon singing, and that's how they got that into\nthe plan. But we weren't really getting formal music instruction in the school.\nI got my formal music instruction from private teachers. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: So you were unusual in that respect? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah. Then, kids took piano lessons. But when I was in high school,\neven in high school, we had a choir. It wasn't much to sing about, you know. But\nmy lessons really came from my teachers. My private teachers were very good, and\nI learned a lot from each one. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1800.0,1860.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What about the church? What was this community like when you started in 1959? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: The community of this church? \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Yeah. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: The church had a long music tradition. Reverend Douglas was a musician\nof sorts and loved to sing I understand. And so, he was the first director of\nthe chancel choir. Well, it was called the senior choir then. He had that choir. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: That was back when he started the church in the community? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah. In the start when Reverend Douglas was here. He was his first\nchoir director. And so I understand that the choir was auditioned. To get into\nthe choir you had to pass an audition from Reverend Douglas himself. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: From the minister and founder of the church to sing in the choir. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah. Right. To sing in that choir. And so there was a lot of talent\nhere. Even when I got here in ' 59, some of those people were still alive and\nwell and singing. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Oh, my. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Oh, yes. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1860.0,1920.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I would dare say that one or two are still alive. They're not\nsinging, but they're still here. There are people who grew up in this church,\nwho sang in that choir. Merrill Fulton [phonetic], who sang in that choir, and\nshe's still alive. She comes to church every Sunday. She doesn't sing anymore.\nMary Fairfax and Mary Randall, and there was a lady, Mrs. Hawkins, who sang in\nthe choir here. There were some who had gone when I got here. There was an\nArthur Warner, sightless man, who was a wonderful voice like, not Harry\nBelafonte, it was a deep baritone. One of them. He sang. Oh, he must have been\nhere ten more years. Maybe even more than that. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: So you had good voices to work with? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1920.0,1980.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How's that? \n\n\n\nDAVIS: You had good voices. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah. There were, especially as far as sopranos. Then people started\ncoming around. Some of these people stopped singing and others came in. I would\nsay that one of the wonderful things that happened here--We had also in this\ntown a group called--there were two groups. One called the Great Hymns Choir. It\nwas started by Dan Rideout [phonetic], he was a Methodist minister, and we need\nto really start that again because congregational song has gone to pot. And Dan\nRideout had this group. A lot of them came out of the Methodist church, but they\ndidn't all come from--we had people from this church who sang in there, people\nfrom other faiths, and they would give concerts on Sunday afternoons, leaning\ntoward the Methodist hymnbook. And then they would sing other music. They would\nsign stuff from the Messiah, and other things that they liked to sing, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=1980.0,2040.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and some\nspiritual arrangements that he enjoyed. But their main thrust was to sing hymns. \n\n\n\nThere was the Baltimore Singers, directed by Gerald Burks Wilson. A Hampton and\nJuilliard grad who started with, I think it was a post office glee club, and\nthose groups were here and still flourishing when I came to Baltimore. \n\n\n\nNow, when I got here, eventually some of those people came to sing in this\nchoir, in this church, and some still do. They're getting up in age now. But\nsome sang in this choir for quite a while. All of them, not all of them, of\ncourse, but as things have declined in other churches as far as music, as far as\ngood music, or great music, or let's say traditional music, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2040.0,2100.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we have been one of\nthe last strongholds, so they will come over here. And people who might not join\nthis church, although this is a very open and free church, will come and sing\nwith us. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: In the choir? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah. They'll come and sing in the choir. We have an open-door policy.\nAnd I'll tell you what happened. A few weeks ago, a relative of one of our choir\nmembers passed away, [distortion] and they weren't sure they were going to be\nable to have a choir for the funeral at another church, and so I gathered up\nsome of my choir members and then they called on the telephone. There were\npeople who came just to sing because they wanted to sing that music. Some will\nnot sing anymore in their church choirs. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2100.0,2160.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There' s been such a decline in what\nthey have been used to singing and what's going on now, and this is not the case everywhere. \n\n\n\nBut a lot of it depends on what the minister wants and his worship style. The\nother has to do with the fact that there is a shortage of good church musicians,\nor committed church musicians. Because as you know, it calls for more than just\nbeing able to play and direct the choir. You have to be committed. We sing at\nthis church at 8:00 in the morning, which means that we are here at 7:30 to sing\nfor the 8:00 service. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: And that's on the weekends. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yes. Yeah. [Laughter] We are here. This was designed by the former\nminister who wanted this choir to sing at 8:00, and so we fell into place. We\nhave given concerts in this church at 7:45. One Easter Sunday, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2160.0,2220.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we sang a short\nconcert before the service began at 7:45. We did it this past Easter also. So\nthat's how committed they are. It calls for commitment. And they will not really\ngrouse about it. \n\n\n\nWhen we found out we were going to be singing 8:00 every Sunday, a lot of people\nwere concerned, but I said, you know, we don't have to worry. For years this\nchoir sang both services before the other choir was formed. Before the\ninspirational choir came along, we had both services. Which means you sing one\nservice, and you run out to McDonald's and get you a soda, a sandwich and\ncoffee, and run back in and get ready for the next service. What I would\njokingly call the first and second show. \n\n\n\nSo that's where we are. But we sing the 8:00 service. This past Sunday was an\nexception so the other choir could have a vacation Sunday. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: So you're busy. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2220.0,2280.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Busy choir. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Well, a little bit. Then our handbell choir meets on Saturdays in the afternoon. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: So, what kind of music have you been programming over the past forty\nyears here? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah. Right. I would say that we sing the standard stuff, but we go a\nlittle beyond that. I like to venture off into--well, I went through my love for\nBritish contemporary anthems. Benjamin Britten, [William] Walton, John Ireland.\nBut then we also would teach them, we'd sing standard things here. Then we'd\nreach out. New composers would come on the scene. I was trying to think of\nsomebody. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2280.0,2340.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Some of the younger composers--I think I'm having a mental breakdown here. \n\n \n\nOh, we sing John Bell. We've sung some of his stuff. We sang, under Black\ncomposers, Undine Moore, we sang Dett. There's a new composer, arranger, on the\nscene. We sing, of course, Robert Morris. And we sing music by Hogan, Moses\nHogan. We sing a lot of traditional spirituals. We sing Dett and Dawson, William\nC. Handy. It's sort of a mission I have on keeping the traditional Black music\nalive. Because people don't sing it a lot of the churches. And then if you sing\nit, a lot of times, it's been tampered with. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2340.0,2400.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So we sort of hang on to that. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: What do you consider traditional Black music? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Traditional Black music, I would say, music that we had--when John\nWork--we talk about Fisk Jubilee Singers, of course. That tradition is one\nthat's not as well-known as it should be. And we sing the John Work arrangements\nfrom his American Negro songs and the things he wrote for the Jubilee Singers.\nWe sing those. \n\n\n\nThe things that Dawson wrote for the Tuskegee Choir, that Dett wrote for the\nHampton Choir and for the community. Dett wrote a collection of books, published\nby Schmitt, Hall \u0026 McCreary, an auditorium series that's almost obsolete now.\nYou can't find it anymore. Then he also wrote arrangements that he had. Then\nthere's the Hampton songbook that Dett compiled. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2400.0,2460.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And these things have come and gone. \n\n\n\nThere's Wendell Whalum, who was at Morehouse for years, who wrote stuff for SATB\nas well as TTBB, and we sing his originals. Robert Morris, who was at Jackson\nState and also Winston-Salem State Teachers College, now State Teachers\nUniversity, has written music for several styles. Traditional spirituals, he's\nwritten a wonderful arrangements of gospel songs. He's written \"He Knows How\nMuch We Can Bear,\" \"These Streets I Know.\" They're very sophisticated, jazzy,\nand difficult to sing. Mr. Morris has visited us. They are difficult. \"Lead Me,\nGuide Me,\" Mr. Morris has written, which is a real toughie, and \"I Thank You, Jesus.\" \n\n\n\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2460.0,2520.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But this group of people will decide, after they finish moaning, will dig in and\ntry to sing and do a credible job. A lot of work. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: So you see yourself as an educator for your choir, I guess, as well. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: I think it's necessary to do that. I think that you not just get ready\nfor Sunday morning, that they know what you're about. What is it that we're\ndoing here. That you talk about it. You talk about it. We analyze the piece. We\ntalk about whether it's a simple piece, or if it's contrapuntal, and what he's\ndone with the melody, and that they know. \n\n\n\nSomebody told me, or really I read this, that, I think, [James] Levine, talking\nabout the Metropolitan Opera Orchestra, that you might make some mistakes, but\nas long as the orchestra knows and you're in full agreement on where we working\nand where we're going with this piece, you can go. And I feel that and I think\nthat. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2520.0,2580.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I think that's true with a choir. If they know where you're going, and\nI've told this choir. Since I've been here, this is the longest job I've ever\nhad with a choir. I said the day that you tell me that you don't want to do what\nI'm doing, you're going to leave. \n\n \n\nIt's not always what the minister wants. If the choir will work with you on your\nmission, then you have something going. And then we don't spend any time\nfighting the minister, we just have our things that we do. And, of course, he\ncomes around because we're fairly successful with what we do. And, of course,\nnobody wants sloppy work. Ministers don't want sloppy work no matter what you're\nsinging, an English anthem or a gospel song, they don't want sloppy work.\nCongregation won't settle for it, either. So you dig in and you go for broke. \n\n\n\nIt' s been a delight. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2580.0,2640.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I know that I have more yesterdays than tomorrows, but as\nlong as I'm able I will hang on as long as they decide they want me to stay here. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: How has the relationship between the music you do here at Douglas\nMemorial changed with the secular community outside the walls? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: How's that? \n\n\n\nDAVIS: How has the relationship between sacred and secular music changed while\nyou've been here at Douglas, at least in this community? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Oh, well, it has happened. For instance, we would never think of having\nhip-hop here, but we have a youth fair. I was away, and they had a hip-hop\nartist, religious hip-hop. And it was well received by the people who came. \n\n\n\nPeople would like to think that is a mainline church. I don't think about things\nas mainline anything. I think that if you pursue whatever it is you're doing\nwith vigor, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2640.0,2700.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it doesn't matter if you're a rocking, socking gospel singing\nchurch, then be that. If you're going to be a church that's going to sing\nchorales and spirituals, let's sort of say an eclectic collection of stuff, then\nevery time you get up to perform on Sunday morning, and really it's a form of\nworship, we all do it, this is our contribution, this is our worship moment,\nthen you're going to give it your best shot. That means you're going to have to\ncome to rehearsal, and you have to learn the music, and do your best possible job. \n\n\n\nAnd that is not really about congregational song. I would say that there have\nbeen fusions of hip hop and rock. We even have a drum set in our church now that\nthe other choir uses, but it's sort of on the conservative side even then. I\ndon't know where it's going. I don't know where it's going to be. We're not\nasked to do it. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2700.0,2760.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We find that sometimes people, ministers especially like to talk\nabout a blending, and there's still some question about blending. \n\n\n\nI think that people prefer certain things. There are people who like to have\nrocking, socking gospel music. They're not necessarily interested in traditional\nhymns. And let them have that. And then there are people who are interested in-- \n\n\n\nNow, we don't just sing the same old hymns. We've scoured the hymnbook. There's\na lot of stuff that has caught people unaware. I think the British have gotten\nahead of us. They've been churning stuff out that we never touched. And if we're\nnot careful, we will just sing the same old ten hymns. But that doesn't happen\nhere. We work at it a little bit harder than that. So we work at it. We'll be\ngoing through the hymnbook. \n\n\n\nI think that the heart of worship service is not what the choir does. It's not\nnecessarily what the organist does, but what the congregation does. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2760.0,2820.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I'm\nalways thinking about ways of getting that congregation involved so on Sunday\nmornings--I've gotten away from your question. \n\n\n\nBut when it's a piece, a traditional spiritual, let's say, you're going to sing,\nthere's a piece that Wendell Whalum calls \"He That Believeth\" or \"How Do You\nFeel When You Come Out of the Wilderness.\" The way that it's written is not very\nfancy. It's good solid harmony that I invite the congregation to sing. So after\nthe choir sings a couple of choruses of it, I turn to the congregation. They\nknow that they're going to be invited to sing, and so they sing along, which is\nwhat it's all about. The congregation, it all praises God. If they can do that\non a gospel song, they can do it on a spiritual. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: And you've been doing that since 1959 here? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: How's that? \n\n\n\nDAVIS: You've been doing that your whole time here. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Oh, yeah. I had to gather enough nerve to do it first, you know. When\nyou change your mind about some things. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2820.0,2880.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, we have now of course Mr. Bascom,\nloves to sing.  He's a song leader. He also loves the hymns. So I have a lot of\nhelp. So he likes to sing. He liked to sing the old songs. And he would sing\nthem, and the spirituals, he would sing them and he would get the congregation\ninvolved. Sometimes they didn't know it. He just taught it to them right on the\nspot. And we still do that. \n\n \n\nDAVIS: I guess this may be another question. Just one more question for you.\nWhen you came here in 1959, the divisions between the White and African American\ncommunity in Baltimore was a lot clearer, and there was still a lot of\nsegregation going on. And how have you found it different conducting a choir at\na traditionally African American church than conducting a mixed choir or a White\nchoir? Do you find that there are big differences? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Oh, okay. All right. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Have those differences changed in the past forty years that you've been here? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: No. I'll tell you what happened to me. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2880.0,2940.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421/transcript/38424/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Somehow when I got here, now\nthere were some churches nearby that were White congregations. For instance,\nCity Temple was then Eutaw Place Baptist Church. And I soon learned the\nmusicians around there. And so we became friends. That way I got to learn some\nother musicians around in the larger community, and we would exchange\ninformation. I learned that the organist and choir director at Mt. Vernon Place\nChurch, he was Bruce Bennett [phonetic], on fellowship Sunday--they don't have\nthat Sunday anymore--his choir came to Douglas Memorial Church and my choir went there. \n\n\n\nThen I'm a member of the American Guild of Organists. I'm not a good member. But\nthe White musicians who I ran into were finding out what we were about--  \n[END PART 1] ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117421#t=2940.0,3000.0"}]}]},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 2 of 2 - pims0091_HammondS_02.mp3"]},"duration":1186.03755,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/public/images/audio-default.png","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/content/2/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-peabody.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/117/422/original/pims0091_HammondS_02.mp3?1624270851","type":"Audio","format":"audio/mpeg","duration":1186.03755,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["HammondS_2_OHMS_20220608 [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"HAMMOND: --when Gene Belt was at Brown Memorial, we sang several concerts\ntogether and the last few years sang about three hymn-sings. And one of the\nhymn-sings where we had a first performance of some music by Robert Morris. This\npiece was not a spiritual. It was a setting of \"All Creatures of our God and\nKing\" for handbells, choir, and organ. It was a wild piece of music, and we sang\nit. We sang other things with the Brown Memorial Choir. In fact, our choir\nparticipated in the memorial service for Gene Belt last year, which was after\nSeptember 11th.  \n\n\n\nSo, we've had an association with the community, the larger community, as far as\nwe've taken part in ecumenical services. And, of course, we're part of community\nchurch, which is the Council of Community Churches, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=0.0,60.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where there are no other\nchurches in this town I think associated with the International Council, but in\nWashington. We have been associated with them, and we've gone to different\nconferences with interracial, intercultural conferences. Is that answering your question? \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Somewhat. I was just curious, you know, how separate this community was\nand the music going up, when you arrived? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: [Cross-talk] One of the things that was interesting about this\ncommunity when I came here, this was right in the middle of the civil rights\nmovement. Mr. Bascom was one of the leaders of civil rights. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Exactly. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: So people were in and out of this church. The civic interest group,\nChester Wickwire, who I think is still alive out at Hopkins, was in and out of\nthis church. So there were certain--of course, there was segregation and\nseparation, but there was a great thrust to a merging and joining our hands\ntogether. And there was nothing unusual about any number of White people being\nin and out of our congregation. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=60.0,120.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In fact, to this day, when people ask me, is\nthis a Black congregation? I say, no, I say 99.44 percent Black, but it's not\n100 percent Black. In fact, we've had as many as three or four White\ncommunicants, and we still have one who's very active in this church. And people\nhave felt comfortable to come into this church. It's not unusual to come here on\nSunday and find non-Blacks coming to Douglas Memorial Church, and they're not\njust here to hear the gospel music either. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Right. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: But we have not attracted that many out of this community because some\nof them are committed to their own congregation, and I see them coming out of\nchurch. But the others don't know what goes on in here. And that's our\nlittle--it's not really a secret is that then they come and find out. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=120.0,180.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They're\nastonished to find that we are not necessarily a rock-'em, sock-'em,\nknock-'em-down Black congregation. But we're not ashamed of what we do either.\nWe're not trying to be anything but what we are, sort of a mixture of the good\nof whatever it is. \n\n\n\nIf it's a good gospel song, we sing it. If it's a good spiritual, we sing it. A\ngood anthem, we sing it. And so, that brings me back to this good hymn singing,\nthat it comes from singing hymns. So our people at the same time are not out of\nplace where there's a mainly White congregation. They feel very comfortable\nthere because they know the hymns too. They don't feel uncomfortable. They feel\nright at home. So it's been a joy doing it. But there's so much more to be done. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=180.0,240.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, you mentioned civil rights. This church has served very important\nrole here in Baltimore. As a music director, did you find yourself using music\nas a-- \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: With the community, civil rights movement? \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Yeah, with the civil rights movement. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: No. We sort of did what we did. This was sort of led see by the\npreachers. And, of course, the civil rights movement songs, we sang them here.\nAnd some of the things that went on here as far as civil rights did not happen\non Sunday morning. They might have happened on Saturday morning or Wednesday\nmorning or Friday morning. Specific interest groups met here. \n\n\n\nI would like to add one little footnote there. It doesn't have to do with civil\nrights. This is where William Jefferson Clinton announced he wanted to be president. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Really? \n\n \n\nHAMMOND: Yeah. I don't know what was going on. People were all over the place,\nclosing doors and locking doors. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=240.0,300.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And people running all over the place, and he\nwas next door. I was over there giving piano lessons. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Oh, that's funny. [Laughter] \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: But this is also the place where the daughter--let me see, Eldridge\nCleaver's wife was in the youth choir when I came here. So there's a lot of\nstrange things that come out of the church. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: So what was happening on Sunday morning didn't necessarily come out. I\nmean, what was happening on Saturday morning didn't come out with what was\nhappening in the church services? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: No. There was a rather traditional service on Sunday morning. Of\ncourse, Bascom didn't mind addressing the needs of civil rights. And, of course,\nhe went to jail a lot, and marched in Selma. Yeah, and so he has quite a history\nthat everybody knows. Have you interviewed Reverend [Vernon] Dobson? \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Have not. Maybe we should. \n\n \n\nHAMMOND: Union Baptist Church. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=300.0,360.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's quite a history too. That's a stronger,\nlong history. He can address some of those things. So, what went on here on\nSunday morning, of course, people came to hear what Bascom had to say. But the\nmusic, the music was a traditional service more or less. And it was quite\ninteresting, I remember talking about the civil rights movement, and there was a\nfilm I saw on Martin Luther King. It was interesting that one of his hymns was\n\"Our God, Our Help in Ages Past.\" And, of course, on this film he was about to\nmake an address, and a choir had come to sing, and they sang Randall Thompson's\nAlleluia. They weren't necessarily singing freedom songs. They'd get around to\nsinging them, but that was not all they sang. And this is what happened here.\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=360.0,420.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There was a need to make sure that our young people knew the music of the large\ncommunity and still hold on to what they had. \n\n\n\nI had the opportunity to tell one of the choirs that came here from Pippa\nPasses, Kentucky, once. I was laughing as I said it to myself, I said, \"Don't\nlose your culture,\" because, of course, they're from shape-note harmony and all\nof that. And it was wonderful hearing them singing, and something I didn't know\nanything about. And during the night at the reception two guys sat down and\nplayed banjo, interrupted and played music while the kids were having a\nreception. And I was just fascinated watching all this. \n\nSo there's this whole thing about world music and about exchange of cultures. \n\n\n\nAnd, of course, there are people who say, oh, you know, you're going to lose\nyour culture by this acculturation and this merging and blending. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=420.0,480.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't think\nso. There are certain things. As long as you know what it is. \n\n\n\nNow I know Black music when I hear it. I know the blues when I hear it. And I'm\nnot upset when somebody else is singing it. I think it's wonderful. Well, one of\nthe things that, we think, some of my Black colleagues and I, say that we know\nour music, we know everybody else's music too. [Laughter] We keep up with\neverybody's music. And so you can't really put people in slots. Looking at me\ndoes not say that I start with gospel music and the blues and jazz, and I don't\nknow anything else. Oh, yes, I'm still learning that. Because there's so much to\nlearn. But then I know about the British hymnbook, too. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Right. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Because I leaned out to learn it. Right behind you is a set of books\nthere called From Lent to Ash Wednesday to Easter, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=480.0,540.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which are British anthems\nthat I--it's not really British anthems, but old standard anthems just in this\npublication. But I introduced this choir to.  \n\n\n\nBut at the same time we are constantly looking for Black music to sing. Always\nlooking for it. So that's why we sing--we have quite a collection here of\nAfrican American music. And, of course, as you know, it doesn't all have to have\na Black theme. You know, the work of David Baker and Olly Wilson and all these\nguys. Adolphus Hailstork. Sometimes they will have themes. Dawson and William\nGrant Still, of course, have definite themes, but not all the other guys have\nthemes. You can't pick it up. You can't tell what the composer looks like, by\njust listening to his music. \n\n\n\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=540.0,600.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Whereas with Hall Johnson, you knew what it was. And, of course, there's Dett.\nEven Dett and Burleigh, they were on a mission. So we try to, and I try to,\nthrough the choir, give all this information to the congregation so that they\nwill know. So we can understand our own culture, but we don't deny them hearing\nother stuff. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: And you still want people to hear Handel and Bach as well. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Oh, yeah, right. And, of course, you can't stop them. Westermeyer\n[phonetic] was talking about something else, but sometimes ministers will come\ninto a congregation like ours, and they'll say, oh, this is a Black church. You\nknow, you just get blacker. Westermeyer was saying that you can't just walk into\na congregation; you have to respect its traditions. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=600.0,660.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we make no apologies for\nsinging Beethoven or Bach here. We sing it with enthusiasm. And we also don't\nmake any apologies for singing Dett and Dawson and Dorsey and anybody else. We\njust want to do the best job. And, of course, you don't have as much time to do\nall of it, but I try to expose them to all of it. \n\n\n\nFor instance, tomorrow morning--and we haven't had rehearsal--we're going to\nsing--our chant will be by Roland Carter. And we're singing \"He, Watching Over\nIsrael.\" We're singing \"Let Us Cheer the Weary Traveler,\" which is a Dett piece.\nThen we're singing an old congregational song, \"Who Lifted Me.\" The first hymn\nis a traditional hymn, \"Father, We Praise Thee.\" But this is simple. That's\nwhere we work from.  \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Yeah. Because I know, when you ask a lot of people about music in\nBaltimore's African American community, they say oh, Pennsylvania Avenue, and\nthen they say gospel choirs. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=660.0,720.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: I mean, so there's another world out there. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Oh, there's another world out there. Yeah. Have you been to some of the\nApostolic Churches? \n\n\n\nDAVIS: We're working on it. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: You're working on it. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Have any suggestions? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: I really don't know them. You might want to check over on Caroline\nStreet. There's a church over there, First Apostolic. Now there, it's an old\ncongregation, and then there's also in West Baltimore on Evanston Avenue there's\na big, I can't think of it, but at the shores over there, a First Apostolic. And\nI'm not sure just how, when you say Apostolic does not necessarily mean that\nthey sing gospel music all the time. So I know because I play for weddings over\nthat were very, very high class. [Laughter] ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=720.0,780.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, it's really difficult to slide.\nYou catch some of these churches on certain Sundays and they're doing certain\nthings. And you'll catch certain Sundays because they're doing the best they can\nwith the equipment that they have, with the people that they have. They would be\ndoing something different if they had different personnel. If they had, if\ntalent was available and the musician was available. Some people have resorted\nto certain things because they can't do any better. Of course that brings me\nback to the fact of music in the schools. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Right. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: So it's a very interesting thing, and complex. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Are you dealing with different generations, children of children of\nsingers you had when you started? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Here? \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Uh-huh. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: I'm not working with the children now. I don't work with the children\nnow. But when I worked with the children, we sang a lot of stuff. Not as much as\nsome of them wanted to sing. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=780.0,840.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But we were members of the Choruses Guild, so we\nhad festivals. And they got a chance to sing all kinds of music, and as they've\ngone along, they sang some Black music and some gospel music and they sang music\nvery fine, sang Bach with synthesizers. We did all kinds of stuff in those\nyears. And they just took it as a matter of course. \n\n\n\nAnd a lot of times people like to say that because you like Bach and Brahms,\nthere's a class distinction. There's not a class distinction. Never has been.\nIt's who happens to be close enough to the music to get a chance to play it or\nsing it, you just go on singing. You didn't have a certain level or class. And,\nof course, that's something that can cross all cultures. What you are singing\ndefines you. I don't know. \n\nI'm teaching a course now on Black music. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=840.0,900.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is my second time teaching it.\nAnd it's a challenge and very interesting. The first year when I taught a class,\nI had about twenty-five Black students. I met the second class this year, and I\nwill have to look at them very closely because it's about fifty percent Black. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Where is this? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: At UMBC [University of Maryland, Baltimore County]. And the rest of the\npeople are East Indian, Hindi, Israeli students, Latino. My class list looks\nlike the United Nations. [Laughter] And then it's impacting. So I will approach\nthe subject, I still have to approach the subject, but then there will be people\nwho won't have the slightest hint what I'm talking about. Of course, that\nhappened last year because the lack of music in schools, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=900.0,960.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the Black kids didn't\nknow what I was talking about either. \n\n \n\nDAVIS: Even with spirituals? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yes. Oh, we went all the back to Africa. We went back to Africa. We\nhave two texts, one by Francis Bebey, African Music, and the other one is by\nJohn Storm Roberts, Black Music of Two Worlds. And trying to crush those into a\nfew sessions and be over by December is quite something, and we have to\nunderstand about African culture, and we have to understand the countries in\nAfrica. And one of the things that people have to decide, have to make an early\ndecision about, is that Africa is not a country. It's a continent. And you might\nbe talking about Mali, or you might be talking about Cape Verde, and they're all\ndifferent. The countries there that speak French, and there are French-speaking\ncultures. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=960.0,1020.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There's South Africa. So it's a wonderful, wonderful thing, but you\nhave to crush it all. Then, I have to take them down them down to the folklore\nof African American culture in this country, along with the folklore of African\ncultures. Sub-Saharan Africa. \n\n\n\nAnd it blends, and what has happened since then and how did this all bring us to\njazz, and how does it bring us to rock? How does it bring us to hip-hop? And\nit's interesting to know that jazz musicians now are complaining because the\nkids don't think anything about jazz. And that used to be, that's what I grew up\non. Because they know hip-hop and rap, but they don't know anything about jazz.\nI went to a jazz show the other night, and I told somebody, everybody performing\nwas under forty, and everybody who was listening was over forty. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=1020.0,1080.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I went to a jazz show last night, and there were a couple people under\nthirty, but not too many. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Yeah. Right. So that happens. So the performers were wonderful. They\nwere playing jazz and playing their hearts out. They were all youngsters. And\neverybody in there was my age. They were sitting down and enjoying it. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Do you play at all? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: Just a little. I don't consider myself--when I play jazz, I play it by\nmyself. Now sometimes with class, I do know some licks, you know, boogie-woogie.\nI did, I went through all that when I was a junior, growing up, and I sit down\nand give a couple of hot licks on the piano, and the kids sort of giggled. \"Oh,\nI didn't know he had it in him.\" [Laughter] \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Oh, that's funny. \n\n \n\nHAMMOND: But I understand the styles, you know, the gospel styles. I don't know\nall the gospel styles, but I listen, and then I imitate. And that's just God\nworking through me. Not that I work at it all that much. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=1080.0,1140.0"},{"id":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422/transcript/38425/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, thank you very much. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: I don't know if I answered any of your questions. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Oh, you answered, and you gave me a whole bunch more I think. Start\nthinking about in the future. But I appreciate your time. Thanks for talking to\nus. You have any parting comments or words of wisdom? \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: No, no, no, no. Tonight I will. About eleven or twelve o'clock I'll\nsay, oh, we should have discussed this, or we should have discussed that. \n\n\n\nDAVIS: Well, many thanks. \n\n\n\nHAMMOND: All right. Okay. [INTERRUPTION] \n\n\n\n--we have in our library. It will give you an idea of what goes on here. How\nmuch time do you have? \n\n\n\n[END OF SESSION] ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://streaming.peabody.jhu.edu/collections/1178/collection_resources/44135/file/117422#t=1140.0,1200.0"}]}]}]}